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	<title>Comments on: Guest Workers and The Ultimate Liberal Aim</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/</link>
	<description>The Sweet Release of Reason</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:37:28 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Club Troppo &#187; The rise of welfare feudalism?</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-581579</link>
		<dc:creator>Club Troppo &#187; The rise of welfare feudalism?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 23:59:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-581579</guid>
		<description>[...] Will&#8217;s solution to is to allow foreign workers access to the labour market, but deny them access to welfare entitlements. And if that isn&#8217;t possible, then he argues that the next best solution is to promote illegal immigration. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Will&#8217;s solution to is to allow foreign workers access to the labour market, but deny them access to welfare entitlements. And if that isn&#8217;t possible, then he argues that the next best solution is to promote illegal immigration. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: bjk</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-500566</link>
		<dc:creator>bjk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jan 2008 18:00:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-500566</guid>
		<description>Wouldn't the ultimate liberal aim be better served by selling US citizenship rather than through guest workers or immigration? Let's say you auctioned off say citizenship rights equal to 1% of the US each year, so 3 million passports. In turn you got $100000 per passport, which doesn't sound crazy considering all the wealthy people who want to live here. In fact, the cost would probably be much higher. If my math is right, that's $300 billion per year, which buys alot of enchiladas. If you share just 1/3 of that with the displaced immigrants who would have taken those immigration slots, the would-be guest workers or immigrants would be much better off. If libertarians see nations as clubs, why not auction off citizenship like clubs do?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wouldn&#8217;t the ultimate liberal aim be better served by selling US citizenship rather than through guest workers or immigration? Let&#8217;s say you auctioned off say citizenship rights equal to 1% of the US each year, so 3 million passports. In turn you got $100000 per passport, which doesn&#8217;t sound crazy considering all the wealthy people who want to live here. In fact, the cost would probably be much higher. If my math is right, that&#8217;s $300 billion per year, which buys alot of enchiladas. If you share just 1/3 of that with the displaced immigrants who would have taken those immigration slots, the would-be guest workers or immigrants would be much better off. If libertarians see nations as clubs, why not auction off citizenship like clubs do?</p>
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		<title>By: Micha Ghertner</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-495837</link>
		<dc:creator>Micha Ghertner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jan 2008 22:32:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-495837</guid>
		<description>I like how "MaryJ" accuses libertarians of living in a fantasy world while &lt;i&gt;in the very same post&lt;/i&gt; worrying terribly about the well-documented problem of Raul, Miguel and Julio down by the Home Depot, getting their little militia together like Latin versions of Jim Gilchrist. Um, yeah.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like how &#8220;MaryJ&#8221; accuses libertarians of living in a fantasy world while <i>in the very same post</i> worrying terribly about the well-documented problem of Raul, Miguel and Julio down by the Home Depot, getting their little militia together like Latin versions of Jim Gilchrist. Um, yeah.</p>
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		<title>By: MaryJ</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-492731</link>
		<dc:creator>MaryJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 04:47:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-492731</guid>
		<description>From Mr. Wilkinson's comentary called "Marketplace:

"Mexico’s GDP per capita is about what Poland’s was in 2004. That was the year Poland became a part of the E.U., and started sending a large flow of newly-legal migrant workers to a much wealthier Britain. This neither increased British unemployment, nor overtaxed social services. (EDITORIAL comment: These are both big fat lies, but whatever.) 

"It’s been a boon to both the British and the Polish economies, and a higher percentage of Polish workers now circulate back home. Romania and Bulgaria are even poorer than Mexico, but they are now set to integrate their labor markets with the rest of the E.U. in seven years."

The problem is, Mr. Wilkinson, which you so conveniently "forgot" to mention, is that indigenous Britons are leaving their homeland -- where their ancestors have lived for thousands of years -- at the rate of 500K a year, most of them because of the ill effects of massive, inappropriate, and deeply unsettling immigration from a vast plethora of competing non-indigenous, non-compatible cultures. And they are taking their skills and their wealth and their tax base with them. Ultimately this will cause the British economy to collapse, as those replacing the fleeing indigenous population are not as educated, wealthy or law-abiding as the natives. Their number one destination is Australia -- the one Western nation left in the world that has strict immigration policies, and which also offers an approximation of the fleeing Britons'  native Anglo-Saxon culture and values.. Your libertarian fantasies are not going to work in a world where First Worlders will simply flee their native lands for ones that are not overwhelmed by immigration anarchy and cultural displacement. If your fantasy world is indeed so much "richer and freer" as you claim, why are all those Brits fleeing the homeland their ancestors have occupied for thousands of years? Closer to home, why are native-born Californians running away from the "richness" of massive immigration at the rate of 300K per year? 

Massive immigration has also resulted, in both Britain and the US, in LESS freedom, not more, with the introduction of a huge police state to control ever-burgeoning crime rates (Britain has the largest per capita number of CCTV cameras in the world, California has draconian "three strikes and you're out" laws), totalitarian "hate speech" and "anti-racism" laws that have virulently suppressed native culture and traditions, and Orwellian mandatory "diversity training" classes that resemble nothing so much as Maoist self-improvement sessions. 

Also I find it rather amusing that a "libertarian" is using the European Union -- a massive, socialistic, bureaucratic state controlled by unelected elites, which is becoming progressively more totalitarian as time goes by -- as a model exemplar for "freedom."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From Mr. Wilkinson&#8217;s comentary called &#8220;Marketplace:</p>
<p>&#8220;Mexico’s GDP per capita is about what Poland’s was in 2004. That was the year Poland became a part of the E.U., and started sending a large flow of newly-legal migrant workers to a much wealthier Britain. This neither increased British unemployment, nor overtaxed social services. (EDITORIAL comment: These are both big fat lies, but whatever.) </p>
<p>&#8220;It’s been a boon to both the British and the Polish economies, and a higher percentage of Polish workers now circulate back home. Romania and Bulgaria are even poorer than Mexico, but they are now set to integrate their labor markets with the rest of the E.U. in seven years.&#8221;</p>
<p>The problem is, Mr. Wilkinson, which you so conveniently &#8220;forgot&#8221; to mention, is that indigenous Britons are leaving their homeland &#8212; where their ancestors have lived for thousands of years &#8212; at the rate of 500K a year, most of them because of the ill effects of massive, inappropriate, and deeply unsettling immigration from a vast plethora of competing non-indigenous, non-compatible cultures. And they are taking their skills and their wealth and their tax base with them. Ultimately this will cause the British economy to collapse, as those replacing the fleeing indigenous population are not as educated, wealthy or law-abiding as the natives. Their number one destination is Australia &#8212; the one Western nation left in the world that has strict immigration policies, and which also offers an approximation of the fleeing Britons&#8217;  native Anglo-Saxon culture and values.. Your libertarian fantasies are not going to work in a world where First Worlders will simply flee their native lands for ones that are not overwhelmed by immigration anarchy and cultural displacement. If your fantasy world is indeed so much &#8220;richer and freer&#8221; as you claim, why are all those Brits fleeing the homeland their ancestors have occupied for thousands of years? Closer to home, why are native-born Californians running away from the &#8220;richness&#8221; of massive immigration at the rate of 300K per year? </p>
<p>Massive immigration has also resulted, in both Britain and the US, in LESS freedom, not more, with the introduction of a huge police state to control ever-burgeoning crime rates (Britain has the largest per capita number of CCTV cameras in the world, California has draconian &#8220;three strikes and you&#8217;re out&#8221; laws), totalitarian &#8220;hate speech&#8221; and &#8220;anti-racism&#8221; laws that have virulently suppressed native culture and traditions, and Orwellian mandatory &#8220;diversity training&#8221; classes that resemble nothing so much as Maoist self-improvement sessions. </p>
<p>Also I find it rather amusing that a &#8220;libertarian&#8221; is using the European Union &#8212; a massive, socialistic, bureaucratic state controlled by unelected elites, which is becoming progressively more totalitarian as time goes by &#8212; as a model exemplar for &#8220;freedom.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: MaryJ</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-492599</link>
		<dc:creator>MaryJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 02:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-492599</guid>
		<description>Some questions: In a democracy, how do you keep masses of uncontrolled immigrants from voting themselves massive amounts of welfare, at the expense of the native born taxpayer? (Already happening in many parts of the US where povery stricken illegals are basically allowed to vote, like California.) How do you keep masses of uncontrolled immigrants from forming an army that will kick us all out of our homes and take our property so their own people can enjoy them? This posting has convinced me that the libertarian open borders lunatics are just as crazy as the kumbaya-singing, "can't we all get along" left wing multiculturalist lunatics. Both are utopia-driven crazies living in a fantasy world where human nature can be "remade" -- when the totalitarian experiences of the 20th Century has proven the exact opposite. Moreover, it is not in the least bit "racist" to want to preserve native languages, tradiitons and cultures. With open borders, whoever has the biggest population totals will overwhelm and destroy smaller native cultures. I'm not interested in living in a world in which the only two cultures left standing are Subcontintental and Chinese. What of the English, the Danes, the Dutch, the Tongans,the Mauritians, etc.? Do they have no right to survive as as peoples? Libertarians, like Marxists, both erroneously believe that human beings are nothing but economic units. History has proven both of them massively wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some questions: In a democracy, how do you keep masses of uncontrolled immigrants from voting themselves massive amounts of welfare, at the expense of the native born taxpayer? (Already happening in many parts of the US where povery stricken illegals are basically allowed to vote, like California.) How do you keep masses of uncontrolled immigrants from forming an army that will kick us all out of our homes and take our property so their own people can enjoy them? This posting has convinced me that the libertarian open borders lunatics are just as crazy as the kumbaya-singing, &#8220;can&#8217;t we all get along&#8221; left wing multiculturalist lunatics. Both are utopia-driven crazies living in a fantasy world where human nature can be &#8220;remade&#8221; &#8212; when the totalitarian experiences of the 20th Century has proven the exact opposite. Moreover, it is not in the least bit &#8220;racist&#8221; to want to preserve native languages, tradiitons and cultures. With open borders, whoever has the biggest population totals will overwhelm and destroy smaller native cultures. I&#8217;m not interested in living in a world in which the only two cultures left standing are Subcontintental and Chinese. What of the English, the Danes, the Dutch, the Tongans,the Mauritians, etc.? Do they have no right to survive as as peoples? Libertarians, like Marxists, both erroneously believe that human beings are nothing but economic units. History has proven both of them massively wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred S.</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-484031</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred S.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 08:36:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-484031</guid>
		<description>Well, you'd have to specify what "empirical evidence" you're talking about. To my knowledge, no one has suggested that massive low-skill, Latin American immigration is conducive to social cohesion (Prof. Putnam's recent study says precisely the opposite) and the arguments that illegal immigrants committ crime at rates lower than the American average are highly dubious. If cultural continuity has "racial elements", by all means "unpack" it; don't jump immediately to the slur.

 The "racism" charged isn't disliked because it "stings"; it's application is resented because, in modern-day America, it has the same relationship to reasoned debate as the atomic bomb has to conventional warfare. It is an ad hominem attack, which bypasses the merits of the interlocutor's arguments and proclaims to an audience "I have looked into my opponent's soul, perfectly understood his motivations, and have decided that he is beyond the pale of civilised discourse; under no circumstances should anything he says be considered".

 Because this slur tends to be unanswearble, has enormous deterrent effect (no one wants to be labelled a racist) and helps the user to convince himself that he is battling unadulterated evil rather than engaging in reasoned discourse, it takes some discipline and no small amount of good faith not to engage it at any and all opportunities. Both these qualities are in short supply.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, you&#8217;d have to specify what &#8220;empirical evidence&#8221; you&#8217;re talking about. To my knowledge, no one has suggested that massive low-skill, Latin American immigration is conducive to social cohesion (Prof. Putnam&#8217;s recent study says precisely the opposite) and the arguments that illegal immigrants committ crime at rates lower than the American average are highly dubious. If cultural continuity has &#8220;racial elements&#8221;, by all means &#8220;unpack&#8221; it; don&#8217;t jump immediately to the slur.</p>
<p> The &#8220;racism&#8221; charged isn&#8217;t disliked because it &#8220;stings&#8221;; it&#8217;s application is resented because, in modern-day America, it has the same relationship to reasoned debate as the atomic bomb has to conventional warfare. It is an ad hominem attack, which bypasses the merits of the interlocutor&#8217;s arguments and proclaims to an audience &#8220;I have looked into my opponent&#8217;s soul, perfectly understood his motivations, and have decided that he is beyond the pale of civilised discourse; under no circumstances should anything he says be considered&#8221;.</p>
<p> Because this slur tends to be unanswearble, has enormous deterrent effect (no one wants to be labelled a racist) and helps the user to convince himself that he is battling unadulterated evil rather than engaging in reasoned discourse, it takes some discipline and no small amount of good faith not to engage it at any and all opportunities. Both these qualities are in short supply.</p>
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		<title>By: Will Wilkinson</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-483133</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Wilkinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 15:52:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-483133</guid>
		<description>Fred, The racism point invariably comes up in part because many immigration opponents remain completely unmoved by empirical evidence regarding things like crime, social cohesion, etc. favorable to higher rates of immigration. And notions like "cultural continuity" when unpacked very often contain racial elements. Immigration foes don't like the charge of racism, because it stings, but in my experience it often does apply, does motivate opposition to immigration, and in those cases, it is not at all a facile to point it out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fred, The racism point invariably comes up in part because many immigration opponents remain completely unmoved by empirical evidence regarding things like crime, social cohesion, etc. favorable to higher rates of immigration. And notions like &#8220;cultural continuity&#8221; when unpacked very often contain racial elements. Immigration foes don&#8217;t like the charge of racism, because it stings, but in my experience it often does apply, does motivate opposition to immigration, and in those cases, it is not at all a facile to point it out.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred S.</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-482869</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred S.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 11:36:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-482869</guid>
		<description>Will,

  That's fine. Some libertarians speak as though the right to contract with whomever whenever were some sort of fundamental, inalienable right which ought to trump all other interests. 

  The fact is, economic concerns are but one-tenth of the argument against immigration. The failure to grapple with externalities (in terms of crime, population density, social cohesion, cultural continuity, etc.) ensures that libertarians absent themselves from 90% of the debate. 

 To the extent that these concerns are addressed by libertarians, they usually adopt Alphie's technique: the mindless and facile slur of "racism".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will,</p>
<p>  That&#8217;s fine. Some libertarians speak as though the right to contract with whomever whenever were some sort of fundamental, inalienable right which ought to trump all other interests. </p>
<p>  The fact is, economic concerns are but one-tenth of the argument against immigration. The failure to grapple with externalities (in terms of crime, population density, social cohesion, cultural continuity, etc.) ensures that libertarians absent themselves from 90% of the debate. </p>
<p> To the extent that these concerns are addressed by libertarians, they usually adopt Alphie&#8217;s technique: the mindless and facile slur of &#8220;racism&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: a Duoist</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-482808</link>
		<dc:creator>a Duoist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 10:22:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-482808</guid>
		<description>We libertarians continue to argue immigration as if it were merely an issue of free economics. But every Paris riot, every genocide, all revolutions--even mass migrations--are grounded in the psychology of human identity formation, not just economic decisions. Immigration is a far more complex issue than economics, or free markets. Osama bin Laden is a second generation immigrant, to point out an extreme example: highly educated, independently wealthy, enjoys organization. An ideal immigrant...but what makes up his personal identity, other than self-loathing?

The American people are not going to support porous borders, cosmopolitan liberalism or not, so long as the social sciences are not an integral part of the solution, as well as free economics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We libertarians continue to argue immigration as if it were merely an issue of free economics. But every Paris riot, every genocide, all revolutions&#8211;even mass migrations&#8211;are grounded in the psychology of human identity formation, not just economic decisions. Immigration is a far more complex issue than economics, or free markets. Osama bin Laden is a second generation immigrant, to point out an extreme example: highly educated, independently wealthy, enjoys organization. An ideal immigrant&#8230;but what makes up his personal identity, other than self-loathing?</p>
<p>The American people are not going to support porous borders, cosmopolitan liberalism or not, so long as the social sciences are not an integral part of the solution, as well as free economics.</p>
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		<title>By: Will Wilkinson</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-482041</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Wilkinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jan 2008 19:12:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-482041</guid>
		<description>Fred, The right to travel and contract freely may be limited if it conflicts with other rights. If Americans have a right to security against external aggressors, and that right cannot be secured if citizens are selling weapons to the enemy, then the right to do so may be limited.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fred, The right to travel and contract freely may be limited if it conflicts with other rights. If Americans have a right to security against external aggressors, and that right cannot be secured if citizens are selling weapons to the enemy, then the right to do so may be limited.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred S.</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-481590</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred S.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:51:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-481590</guid>
		<description>Just a quick question, Will. Your pro-migration argument seems premised on the notion that people have some sort of absolute (natural) right to freely contract which is unjustifiably impinged upon by the various gov'ts. Would you argue that an American company ought to be permitted, for example, to sell weapons to a foreign nation with which the United States was at war?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a quick question, Will. Your pro-migration argument seems premised on the notion that people have some sort of absolute (natural) right to freely contract which is unjustifiably impinged upon by the various gov&#8217;ts. Would you argue that an American company ought to be permitted, for example, to sell weapons to a foreign nation with which the United States was at war?</p>
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		<title>By: alphie</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-481374</link>
		<dc:creator>alphie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jan 2008 07:38:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-481374</guid>
		<description>China has to deal with over 100 million migrant workers and it's still kicking America's arse economically.

We'd rather be racist than rich, I 'spose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>China has to deal with over 100 million migrant workers and it&#8217;s still kicking America&#8217;s arse economically.</p>
<p>We&#8217;d rather be racist than rich, I &#8217;spose.</p>
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		<title>By: Will Wilkinson</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-478306</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Wilkinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Dec 2007 03:37:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-478306</guid>
		<description>The common European labor market does exist, and even continues to grow, in case you missed that. Actuality strictly entails possibility, no?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The common European labor market does exist, and even continues to grow, in case you missed that. Actuality strictly entails possibility, no?</p>
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		<title>By: Carter</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-478293</link>
		<dc:creator>Carter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Dec 2007 03:20:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-478293</guid>
		<description>There is no indication of the interventionist state being undermined anywhere. Even Mises concedes that until there is, immigration fears are justified. 

Mises appears to have thought getting rid of the interventionist state, along with the creation of a right of secession (see sec.2) were necessary conditions in order to have "universal movement". Libtertarians today assure us they will do those things &lt;i&gt;after&lt;/i&gt; the borders are thrown open.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no indication of the interventionist state being undermined anywhere. Even Mises concedes that until there is, immigration fears are justified. </p>
<p>Mises appears to have thought getting rid of the interventionist state, along with the creation of a right of secession (see sec.2) were necessary conditions in order to have &#8220;universal movement&#8221;. Libtertarians today assure us they will do those things <i>after</i> the borders are thrown open.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Tievsky</title>
		<link>http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-478072</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Tievsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Dec 2007 23:53:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2007/12/29/guest-workers-and-the-ultimate-liberal-aim/#comment-478072</guid>
		<description>Thank you, Will--a very valuable article that changes how I think about the issue of guest worker programs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Will&#8211;a very valuable article that changes how I think about the issue of guest worker programs.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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